Tulpa.info - tulpa-discussion

Where is your evidence?

2:29 AM

As opposed to the field of neurology.

2:29 AM

In its entirety.

he's not even arguing at this point, it's over, move on

3

1

Uroboros

he's not even arguing at this point, it's over, move on

I find it difficult to stop. It's like watching someone crash a car. This strikes me as a really sad display that all started when I hurt his fee fees and now he's trying desperately to make it seem like my position is somehow under question... relative to the man who has a rich inner delusion about fighting with an avian parasite.

The language here is so incredibly “intellectual” that it’s laughable

As if he's going to trigger some sort of schizophrenic realization in me and I'll fall into some sort of hellish state.

I get it. but consider this. if he's a troll, then every additional comment you make is another victory for him, and he's not even talking any more

Let the dude have an opinion

2:33 AM

It’s an argument on discord

2:33 AM

Not a court of law, not a debate club

I don't think he's a troll, I pity him. Also I like idly debating, it doesn't bother me like I know it bothers some others.

Hey hey... Realisation is not for people that can only think in one dimension.. Let's not get crazy

This is an incredibly fun show to watch, so idk

2:34 AM

If you aren’t going to stop, guess I may as well make the best of it.

glad that's over, it was bad lol

@REDD❗ oh come on.. it was fun

Diogenes cursed

@REDD❗ oh come on.. it was fun

good that you found it fun, after all you were in it

Lmao

Nobody used bad words or stuff like that, so I mean what's the problem? I do psychology dude not psychiatry.. how would you want me to do my job if I look at you like a machine?..

To be honest that is the issue with psychology. It has yet to fully merge with neurology in a way that's actually rigorous.

2:37 AM

It should be mechanistic but is not.

2:38 AM

It will likely be many generations before it is.

I see a beautiful creature with a universe inside of it .. and I have to try to understand how it works.. by using logical and not logical thinking. It's more about production that about truth

2:39 AM

Some people dream this level of communication...what do we do with them?

It's moments like these I think you're secretly proxi using gpt-2 on me.

2:40 AM

sniffs I miss proxi. I cri many salty tears.

Ethics is the problem with what you are saying.. not the facts

2:41 AM

Look, Drapetomania for example

2:41 AM

Drapetomania was considered a conjectural mental illness that, in 1851, American physician Samuel A. Cartwright hypothesized as the cause of enslaved Africans fleeing captivity

2:42 AM

So in that moment was a fact..but the problem is.. well

2:43 AM

So do you understand my point in saying ethics is the problem?

You are saying that research can be biased, but in this case I'm saying there is no reason for you to believe that. Neurology itself has been trying to point to identity for a long time, in many ways, the lack of results on that front are as substantial as the somewhat meta knowledge I was pointing to. Psychology is biased because it starts with conclusions and works backwards. This has always been its crippling flaw. Neurology studies states of brains and builds correlations. It's built on data, not on presumption. (edited)

2:51 AM

The lack of true science, is why psychology is, and will be flawed, until it fully merges with neurology. (edited)

Bulici, proxi, both end in i. Name sounds like "bully, see" Hzzmmm

So all that is not epistemology can be phagocytized by it or become wrong... Couldn't I care less, science is just one of the many building blocks... What about an existencial plane? The historical plane? What about the economical and cultural dimensions? You have to be able to use as many as possible.. and to follow different patterns.. What's the point of scientific minds saying that science is truth ? I mean you're supposed to break and destroy the paradigm to advance science not suck its dick. So.. it's fine you have your castle and I have mine, I helped by the Holly war, was able to give sense to all those dimensions that seem like understand me. Some people have one some have many it's that ok ?

2:59 AM

@LyricThunder oh come on.. just trying to say something.. not being a bully

phagocytized? I'm starting to think you should have to get licensed before owning a thesaurus

1

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phagocytosis

Yep... I'm a bitch alright

3:01 AM

3:02 AM

In Italy is 4 am..

Bulici, you seem to have presumed your inner world is negative to me. That I am shitting on it. That could not be further from the truth. Mine is likely equally rich, it's reinforced with hypnosis to the point where I'm able to have a... substantial physical relationship with a thoughtform. What I am asking you to consider is not whether you should have an inner world. I am asking you to consider whether you are okay. Really. What you said, when taken together, didn't sound okay. Perhaps you misrepresented how much you'd grown or healed, and you genuinely are okay. But that's for you to decide. I was only responding to your statement as it was.

3:03 AM

But here's the thing. My thoughtforms are no threat to me. I'm in immaculate control and I am content pretty much all the time in addition to having a great time with my tulpa. Are you? Because what you described sounded like fakery and paranoia. Even among the ally-ones.

Ally-ones are very nice, they just very active and they want to learn and live as much as possible. So they demand allot but it's ok.. I mean i love that they demand, I like when I have to satisfy a strong desires.. it's like making a woman that can't come, come ...or making a woman that always comes , come... It's fun ok, but it doesn't feel like I have one anything.. It must feel like a won battle you know? To truly appreciate control. I think, for me. But the bird mhhh he is a bad dude, but I get it.. I use him to change empathy into a knife..

But as times goes by I fight with less and less people and he feels left out so he trys to come out as he can, he tries to hurt who he can, me. But he gives me a reason to not lower my guard.. like, life is gonna eat you if you don't stay up the water. Is like having a strong and continued perception of death to enjoy life more

3:15 AM

Best times of my life wore spent with the Tulpa.. but I mean, all my girlfriend's wore crazy.. I like the dramma and the fight's.. Hurt me so I know you care?

Y'know you say these things and my response is literally always "Wow you've got some issues." Your narrative sounds better there at least, experientially. What I said before is still my position: All the things we tell ourselves is merely a story, a compelling one. Whether the story is actually bad or good is usually irrelevant. What matters is what you feel about it. That's what tells you if something is wrong or right.

3:23 AM

It is currently 3:22 AM, and my mental lover is telling me to sleep. So I will sleep for now. (edited)

Well if it leads to good outcomes. People definitely do crap that they think feels good that ain't good for em

@LyricThunder Amin ! Smoking...

3:24 AM

@Zen yeahhhhhh... It's 4:24 in Italy

3:24 AM

It's time

3:25 AM

Good night bruh, amazing stuff that you are able to do with you inner world.. never heard something like that

these big words are hurting my head

i haven't seen or heard Fel for a while

11:18 PM

and that's normal, such hibernation/power off periods are sometimes even beneficial for the entire system any ideas how to make this process quicker tho? (edited)

Instead of superficially trying to make a relationship exist: consider instead what you want to do and how they can fit in. Also understand that their enthusiasm can be infectious and when I say what you want I mean either of you.

Deleted User

and that's normal, such hibernation/power off periods are sometimes even beneficial for the entire system any ideas how to make this process quicker tho? (edited)

you want to make the hibernation quicker?

Phoenix

you want to make the hibernation quicker?

shorter,i mean.

11:26 PM

and waking up/powering on quicker

S'all about passion. And passion is a tricky beast. Can't be forced, really, but if you figure out what makes you passionate you can direct it a little.

i'm passionate about her, because she's my first OC that i really enjoyed creating (edited)

12:26 AM

and the first one that wasn't edgy or grumpy

12:27 AM

aaaand because her status as a tulpa was an effect of intensive roleplaying, that i (we) enjoyed a lot :V

12:27 AM

also, androids.

What you are describing to me sounds like attachment, not passion. Passion is a hunger that seems bottomless when you have it, but is quite fickle.

uhhh

12:43 AM

then i dunno

12:43 AM

maybe there's no passion anymore

12:43 AM

but there is a pretty strong attachment (edited)

Maybe. Learning how to be passionate is something that takes self-reflection if you wish to cause it or rekindle it. Sometimes it's just out of reach in the way that you think you should have it. It's a whole thing that I would encourage you to feel out.

well

1:16 AM

i just looked at the Forum and several random topics (edited)

1:17 AM

and it looks like (most of) you all have fun with your headmates from time to time

1:18 AM

some people are writing a book ( winks to one particular duo)

1:18 AM

some are drawing

1:19 AM

some are simply chilling in Wonderlands after a busy day full of work (edited)

1:19 AM

and i wonder why our system (Me and Felicja) isn't having just as much fun with tulpamancy (edited)

1:23 AM

and every time we talk to each other we do either instantly get into argument for a shitty reason,are unable to decide what to do, one of us needs to cheer the other one up... or Felicja simply starts acting ""horny"" to get some extra attention while i'm busy. (edited)

1:26 AM

and that's how it looks like literally right from the beginning

1:26 AM

for over a year

Sounds... not dissimilar to how me and Mika used to be with each other. Mika eventually decided they were the issue and decided to majorly overhaul their own personality - by merging with the character they were based on, who was less neurotic. This worked, but it's up to you if you can tolerate the idea of them changing radically into a different person.

1:32 AM

At a certain point we recognized our arguments started and went nowhere. Internal drama for the sake of it, really. It became unjustifiable to continue when we both knew we were just making our collective life worse. Thing is: I didn't want such a change, so it ended in a dissipation that I'm still uncertain about, and might reverse.

1:35 AM

At any rate though, I would suggest you consider what your actual ideal relationship should look like (understanding that it won't be perfect, of course). And consider whether Fel can actually be that for you. One or both of you may need to change how you act purposefully at the minimum or make the ritual effort like that to change personality if you prefer immediate results.

i agree for anything if it would make our relationship better!

Take some time, do it the manual way. Be less confrontational. Learn to act better first if you think that is within your ability. If not, you'll always have time in the future to start ripping out and replacing components I guess or some similar overly dramatic piece of mechanical symbolism. The more emotionally resonating the better, by the way, including if it's disturbing. I consider this kind of personality surgery a step down from dissipation in terms of how extreme it is. It's not ideal if you can find a better way.

Zen

Take some time, do it the manual way. Be less confrontational. Learn to act better first if you think that is within your ability. If not, you'll always have time in the future to start ripping out and replacing components I guess or some similar overly dramatic piece of mechanical symbolism. The more emotionally resonating the better, by the way, including if it's disturbing. I consider this kind of personality surgery a step down from dissipation in terms of how extreme it is. It's not ideal if you can find a better way.

I think it greatly depends how you go about this, extreme is not always better. Some extreme symbolism includes violent dissipation, and is likely to create more anxiety than feelings of resolution. The symbolism for something can be complex and sophisticated, but be careful about how dramatic something is. Things like personality surgery and dissipation can have a lot of symbolism, but it doesn't need to be more dramatic than it already is- just going through the experience is dramatic enough usually.

less confrontational? our every talk/argument is a "Me versus Him" thing, so trying something else sounds like a really good idea

speaking of "replacing components or some overly dramatic piece of mechanical symbolism" - first, we need to imagine these components (it became some kind of taboo topic in our system, he refuses to even mention my imaginary insides). Then we need to believe that changing the form would change ourselves as well, since tulpa =/= form. (edited)

A long kiss goodnight

I think it greatly depends how you go about this, extreme is not always better. Some extreme symbolism includes violent dissipation, and is likely to create more anxiety than feelings of resolution. The symbolism for something can be complex and sophisticated, but be careful about how dramatic something is. Things like personality surgery and dissipation can have a lot of symbolism, but it doesn't need to be more dramatic than it already is- just going through the experience is dramatic enough usually.

On the contrary though such things cause anxiety, a connection with a strong emotional response is what makes hypnotic techniques stick. Mika's method was both dramatic and worrying and worked instantly. If you want a peaceful solution you shouldn't be looking to a technique like this at all. In all ritual there must be a strong emotional response.

Take some time, do it the manual way. Be less confrontational. Learn to act better first if you think that is within your ability. If not, you'll always have time in the future to start ripping out and replacing components I guess or some similar overly dramatic piece of mechanical symbolism. The more emotionally resonating the better, by the way, including if it's disturbing. I consider this kind of personality surgery a step down from dissipation in terms of how extreme it is. It's not ideal if you can find a better way.

@Zen - jump are you sure that violent, gory symbolism can help us changing our attitude or personalities?

Sure? No.

Felicia N.

Take some time, do it the manual way. Be less confrontational. Learn to act better first if you think that is within your ability. If not, you'll always have time in the future to start ripping out and replacing components I guess or some similar overly dramatic piece of mechanical symbolism. The more emotionally resonating the better, by the way, including if it's disturbing. I consider this kind of personality surgery a step down from dissipation in terms of how extreme it is. It's not ideal if you can find a better way.

@Zen - jump are you sure that violent, gory symbolism can help us changing our attitude or personalities?

Violence and gore is irrelevant. At the end of the day it's just a visualization. Approaching it in doubt will also not help. In order to do a successful hypnotic ritual it's all about whether you're invested, immersed, and feeling something from it. I would say that for me a violent image made up on the fly and designed to shock me was quite successful at that and I was already immersed. For you? I dunno, maybe you'd find it easier to come up some other strong emotion to link to a visualization, that you'd find it easier to imagine or trigger?

10:14 PM

Transgressing on some sort of internal taboo does sound like an easy way to do so though, no?

10:14 PM

Again though, I'd say make this a last resort and instead try to grow as a person first.

maybe not the channel for this, but thoughts on this tulpa-adjacent less wrong post?

8:55 PM

https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/X79Rc5cA5mSWBexnd/shoulder-advisors-101

Shoulder Advisors 101 - LessWrong

Motivation for post: As a former CFAR instructor, longtime teacher, and rationality pundit, I find myself giving lots of advice in lots of different contexts. I also try to check in from time to time to find out which bits of advice actually proved helpful to people. Over the years, I've heard from a genuinely surprising number of people that my...